I have been doing some reading and hearing mixed things about what new Headers actually do to performance. If I am type of driver that loves kick when I floor it from a dig . . are they not the right way to go for me? I have been reading that they hurt your speed on the low end but increase your overall speed on the high end? Is this information consistent with what you guys/gals have heard, and is there something that I can do in addition to headers to not lose the low end speed . . . Let me know

---I should also probably add that I have purchased a 3.0" ZZP DP w/ Cat that I will be installing soon ---

Seeing as you have a GTP and not a GT/SE, you aren't going to see a loss in low-end torque with headers.

The N/A motors, we really need that back-pressure to keep our low end up to snuff.

Headers on an L36 drastically lower low-end torque.

But you L67 is Roots supercharged. That blower on there generates tons of low-end torque and actually is very INefficient at higher RPMs.

Headers on a GTP will increase performance in ALL RPM ranges.

Now with headers and a 3" DP, you MAY see a little bit of low-end loss but I'd assume that would have to be aroun 800-1200 RPMs. Anything higher and the unrestricted exhaust flow will help, rather than hurt.


Now I *personally* have no experiance with headers on either engine, or even a stock L67.

My assumptions may be over-dramatic as far as power loss and gain but the information *should* be correct.

Depending on your mod level and your choice of headers but since you have already purchased a 3" dp I would say a power log from ZZP would be a good choice ,with these you would'nt experience any low end loss,now with headers you have S&S with 1 1/2" primaries good bottom end reasonably built headers ,next SLP 1 5/8" primaries a good overall choice more expensive,then pacesetter 1 3/4" primaries with these you would experience some low end loss and the fit is poor but they are cheap ,lastly TOG's the regular with 1 5/8" primaries nice headers then the extremes with 1 3/4" primaries good choice if you are heavily modded ,I suggest whatever you decide go for the ceramic coated for lookes and longevity.Chico.

To build off what Chico said...I was in the same boat: mildly modded and not wanting to lose low end.

I went with the S&S headers for that reason. Not only do they have the smaller primaries, but they have a 2.5" collector instead of 3".

It's more restrictive than TOG in theory, but it flows much better than a powerlog or manifolds would. The only downside to S&S headers is that the O2 location only reads the front back of cylinders unless you relocate it (I'd suggest relocating it anyway to get it away from the dipstick tube).

I've been happy with my headers and I think I actually gained a little on the low end, and DEFINITELY on the top end as well.

This all sounds good.
Note that if you're doing headers soon, forget the downpipe/cat for now, since most/all header packages take care of that.

a header setup does include a DP....headers do not match up with any other DP that is for sale just a reminder with zuul

the powerlog will match up with a 3"dp even though it isnt as big as headers

thats tru the powerlogs are great but not the same performance as headers....Gt=powerlogs, GTP=Headers

I got some plog on the GTP! Like my setup alot.

So the suggestion is that I should return the DP as it will probably not fit well with any of the headers that I will buy? It sounds like headers are the way to go . . . so if thats the case I'll return the DP to ZZP and purchase some different Headers. ZZP I believe only sells the Pacesetters . .. how much do the S & S headers cost and where is the best place to buy them?

w body store for the S&S's. Not sure on cost. Whatever you end up getting though, get them coated!

Yes, the DP will not work with headers, only with stock manifolds or a powerlog.

You can get S&S headers from wbodystore.com or S&S headers' website (I forget which is cheaper). wbodystore.com has a nice writeup comparing all the different headers as well.

Alright, so I found the S & S headers on W-Body Store, however I cannot find the corresponding DP that is supposed to go with it . . . Does it automatically come with one for the $489 price or am I just not seeing it. If my DP from ZZP will not work then I obviously can't just order any DP they have either . . . Also, do I still want to do that U-Bend delete or am I correct in my understanding that Headers/DP takes care of that problem already.

Well your options are S&S headers at $489+ $179for a catted DP+ $150 for coating=$818.00 or keep your DP add a PLOG at $119+$80 for coating=$199 ,I will add that recent testing on the power log has given 12whp gains and good KR fighting ability with no loss on bottom end tourqe, to be really efficient I would say a ported rear should be done but coating is'nt really necessary on the rear as it's stainless.Chico.

x2 thats your options good luck!

Sorry for not mentioning that, I went in circles with Wbody store about that too. They don't carry DPs for the S&S headers because they have to order them from S&S directly and they cost a fortune.

but here is the kicker about the S&S downpipe: It's just a straight tube. All of the curvature of a normal downpipe is built into the header itself. So I went to my local exhaust shop and had them fab up a "downpipe" for me for $40:

It's just a flange, a length of 2.5" pipe and then the flex (which comes with the S&S headers welds on the end of the pipe. BOOM! You have an offroad pipe. If you want a catted version, you can substitute teh straight pipe for a high flow cat.

It sounds like the headers with the specs that I want would cost a lot more than I am prepared to spend at this point. The powerlog and ported rear however sound like a pretty good solution without breaking the bank - so thats probably the route that I will go. Just for future reference, because I will eventually do full exhaust and headers, exactly how much of a performance jump is going to headers over a DP and PLOG?

Well Tog's claim a 18whp gain and the Plog with DP will net 12-14whp so you decide,I personally would like to see a side by side dyno test on the two setups on the same car ,this would be the only fair comparison IMHO.Chico.

Yeah, I agree. You need a side by side on the same car. I don't believe the hp numbers the vendors throw around. Furthermore, there is more than just the initial hp gain by these mods. With exhaust mods they become even more important as you add other mods. The ability to relieve exhaust gases becomes very important. So I think with a medium/heavy modded car you'd feel the effects of the headers even more over a powerlog.

Just my 2 cents though, and I would like to see a side-by-side.