Now I saw one of the new Grand Prix's in person... The new models look smaller than the older smalls.. Now I know there whole moto was wider is better.. Are they smaller or was it just the way I was looking at it. And are they just more classier looking or are they now better performance wise also? I heard they down sized the engines, but I don't know if that is true also

The engines are the same, dimensions are pretty close within an inch or two.

Actually, the engines are not the same as before. They dropped the old 3.1 liter, 175-horsepower base V-6, and now the base engine in the GT1 and GT2 is the 200 horsepower 3800 Series III with an electronic drive-by-wire throttle. The GTP gets a new 3800 Series III with 20 more horsepower than before. So Pontiac actually up-sized the engines....kinda.

Tis true the extra 20hp is nice, but with the body weight being more than the past, and the comp g package adding 100 lbs to the car, I'm not so sure the driver will notice a big difference in acceleration. The 3.29 axle ratio is nice, but I raced against a stock 2001 gtp with my 2004 gtp and I was just barely moving away from him... you'd think that 20 extra horses would make a bigger difference...

Overall, I love the car, though, but it needs the front facsia as the gxp, and it needs lowered!!!!!!!!!

How many miles on your '04? A tight new engine will slow you down compared to a well-broken-in one. [ And I'm not sure where this 100# difference comes from - from the pontiac.com site the total weight difference between comparable 04/03 GTPs is only 24#.] Was the '01 GTP a coupe or a sedan? Was his gas tank empty and yours full? Was your trunk full of junk? These are all weight differences which can effect acceleration.

From a drag race simulator program, the speed difference between the two cars after a 1/4 mile race would be only 2 miles per hour - a pretty slow pull-ahead rate at around 90 mph. It would be much less at 45 mph. I don't know what difference the different final drive ratio would make.

I was referring to the 3800 engine being a carry over from the 2003 GT to the 2004 GT1 and GT2. Tis true the 3100 was eliminated, but I never really gave much thought about a car that size with a 3.1L engine.

both gas tanks full, his car was full of crap, mine was empty and clean with only 518 miles on it... I'm a bit disappointed.

His car was a coupe, but I forgot to mention he redid his intake with the 9" K&N filter.... that had to help a little bit.

About axle ratios, just an FYI: the axle ratio is the number of turns the engine has to turn for the axle to turn once... hence 3.29:1 is the engine has to turn 3.29 times for the axle to turn once. The higher the axle ratio, the faster acceleration, but the lower the top speed, 4:11's would be awesome for drag racing, but 3.29 is good for top end and fuel economy.

Sorry Lorenzo, I should have been more clear. I DO know what the axle ratio is - I don't know how much difference a few tenths in the ratio would make in the acceleration of the '04 vs the '01. But Pontiac says 0.1 seconds faster to 60 mph for the '04 WS6 vs the '04 GTP.

The difference in the intake may or may not make more power - perhaps it added 5-8 hp - but only 500 miles on the clock means you will get better performance in the future - the engine is still tight, 500 miles is the end of the factory-recommended "break in" afterall. His coupe is a bit lighter, but the 'junk' may have evened out the weights a bit. Wait a few months and give him a go again!

I will be sure to do that. Here in a week or so, I'm going to try and put a smaller pulley, and a different intake on the car and see what it does... hopefully I'll gain a lot..., maybe put me in the 14's... haha, that would be nice