on a scale of 1-10 on how hard how much moving and modification to the cars body itself is installing a intercooler i know its not gonna just snap on put a few pipes in then done but how hard is it i would like to run this with a 2.8 pulley with all the supporting mods

Uhm there are no pipes in an air to water intercooler. I think you may be confused with air to air which is not applicable to roots type superchargers.

On a Water to Air I/C you have to remove the S/C off the LIM placing the core in between the two then you have to run lines to a pump that will cycle fluid from the core to the heat exchanger up front back to the core.

I can get into specifics but pics say a thousand words to maybe TIM can post pics.

I ran and Air to Air on my system but I went turbo not supercharged.

I'm gonna say probably a 7 or 8 out of 10. Aside from the intercooler it's self your also gonna have to do a fuel rail mod or out right replacement along with a couple other things as well.

is turbo really that much better i love the sound of superchargers and such but is air to air easier? to install

air to water is much easier to install. you need 2 hoses, a pump, the front mount, and the ic itself. i used 2 90's to come off the ic inlet and outlet, than ran the clear hoses under the spark plug wires by the coil packs, than down to the pump and front mount. i have pics here somewhere just gotta find them.

finished product, as you can see the 2 90's coming off the inlet and outlet on the ic and running under the spark plug wires.


i guess thats the only picture i have....wow I thought I had more, guess not. hope this helps...

not gonna lie those hoses look sick how long did it take to install cause i am going to try to be a mechanic or something that deals with cars but havent gotten that far for i am a senior in highschool and cars is the only thing that holds my attention. anyways do you need to intercool on a turbo'd car? and about how much hp were you making to the wheels

what is the best headlight restorer every time i turn my lights on i wanna kick them in they look groose

It is much better but I don't think you get what I was saying. You have to use certain types of intercoolers for different applications. Why would you ever go turbo just because its easier to mount an air to air intercooler.

Plus going turbo is a damn big investment I'm not going to lie. I would never recommend it unless your going for serious power.

Air to Water is easy, I think air to air is easier.

Have you priced out these setups yet?

For headlights if they are that bad you need some high grit sandpaper and wet sand them then buff w/ compound. Don't just take any grit to your headlights, I don't know off the top of my head but ill look. I know someone on here did a write up. I think I used like 1200grit but off the top of my head I don't remember.

i never dynoed the car after i intercooled and dropped to a 3.2 nor did i ever get a chance to run it at the track. The intercooler took about 4 hrs to install, and it ran me $600 shipped for a zzp fullsize stage 2 with a stage 3 front mount and bosch pump.

forget headlight restore kits. just go and buy new headlights, a guy on clubgp just bought a new set off amazon for like $60. he said they were a good investment, so instead of wasting your time on the restore, just go buy new ones.

I've had success with Mother's headlight restore kit. It comes with fine grit sand paper for the extremely bad lights, a power ball with polish and a micro fibre rag for finishing.

Works real good too. I think the kit was something like $20. They also sell a sealant to help keep the lights clear longer.

I've used it on all the plastics on my vehicles. Turn signals tail lights etc. Makes it all look new again.

could you make a guesstimate on hp 01"

what will your mod list consist of when the intercooler is installed? it all depends on your mod list than and what your mod list is now. intercoolers just keep the blower colder so that you can drop in pulleys without kr. so you can gain anywhere from 35-55hp just depending on what your mod list is before and after.

probably 2.8 pulley very far off into the future with supporting mods

youll probably see around 45hp, which is the average.

45 more then stock?

Ya funny to see peoples reactions when they see just how much it takes to make hp lol. K&N gives you 15hp lmfao more like 1-2 lol.

like i said, it all depends on the amount of/or lack there of KR you see when you drop pulleys. that will determine how much hp you actually make after you do all of the mods.

so if i dropped all the way down to a 2.8 id only make like 325 hp and if that even?

no, if you drop down to a 2.8 you would more than likely have a cam, headers, ported/or gen v blower, upgraded throttle body, bigger injectors, custom tune, intercooler, you would probably see 350whp...but it also depends on your cam, a friend of mine just ran an 11.34 on a 2.7 gen v blower setup with xpz cam, zzp stage 2 intercooler, stage 3 heads, zzp headers, 60lb injectors, custom tune.

You wouldn't see 350whp. You would see around your initial estimate of low 300whp if damn lucky, If he did st3 ported heads xpz cam then sure 350ish whp is attainable. Not gunna happen with an XP cam.

At that point though your soo deep in the hole its not worth it... IMHO

And dont even try to compare with his car you know very well his car is stripped to all hell. Weighs like a honda.

it makes me lol too. Speed cost it depends how fast you want to go.

so are turbos way more cost effective?

nothing about performance parts are cost effective. You'll need the same parts (mostly) weather the air is forced from the intake side (supercharger)or forced from the exhaust side (turbo). If I was going to build a car for speed I'd go with a N/A motor and get rid of everything except the ALT. and power steering pump (cuz I'm lazy) Plus there would only be a couple of wires to hook up and you can work on the dang thing your self and they are extremely easy to tune.

Keep in mind the stock L67 produces roughly 190-200whp. So a gain that improves by 100hp is a big leap.

What is your goal?

Turbo's are more efficient and can take you farther into the big HP numbers.

If you just want something fun to tool around in the S/C is fine and is plenty modable.

N/A would net you if your lucky 180whp after some serious mods so ya its not a v8 lol. Stock gt looking at 140-150whp.

On the turbo subject I would not recommend it to you because your knowledge base on the subject isn't vast.

Imo turbo for you is overkill. You haven't experienced 250whp nvm 350whp. Turbo is if you want 400whp+

new problem... anyone ever repair a lifter?

so basically switch one out?

Lifters are replaced not repaired. And if your gonna change one you might as well change them all and do valve seals while your at it.

You replace all lifters. You have to remove the alt bracket, fuel rails, blower and lim. Take valve covers off, remove the rockers and pushrods. Remove the lifter retainers and then the lifters pull out.

But why do you think you have a failed lifter?

Also, you'll maybe 310 whp on a cammed 2.8 intercooled setup. I'd say a 5/10 on install. You can't really screw uo aside from the gaskets not sealing or keeping the hoses from the belts. Its just a bit time consuming but nothing really compared to a Cam install or head swap.

im a xpz/ed gen3, intercooled with heads setup and i done everything right, i dynod 349 hp, but HP dosent matter, its torque that matters and thats where i put down 449

What dyno? Any spikes on the TQ curve? What pulley size? Dyno sheets?

wow chris, dont believe him?

Curious about the TQ numbers. What crawled up your sandy v private pyle.

now now guys lets cool it a bit ok.

nothing crawled up into me...listen here you gorilla juice head lol, dont start with me! haha

btw: a bone stock L36 will run the numbers in my sig: 150whp and 223 wheel torque. I'm still yet to do another dyno pull and STILL need a tune. I'm guessing without tune, my CAI, 2.5" d/p with h/f cat and HV3 has me somewhere near 200 whp. No guess on torque.

Rick you can't be serious.

The stock L67 is 200 whp. Those mods will get you no where near 200whp. Maybe 200 at the crank but not 200 at the wheels.

Dude, Rob, can I please GUESS?

The way I figure it, 15-20 from the CAI (advertised 40 whp), 10-15 from the HV3 (advertised 30), 10-15 for the d/p, ubend, h/f cat (advertised 20). Tune it for another 15-20. Low end estimate, no tune: 35 whp. High end estimate, no tune: 50 whp.

Sure you can guess but your gonna be WAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYY off.

More like 20whp MAX gain.

Agree with herc. 20 whp sounds about in the ballpark. With tune.

that was at the dyno at ZZP, while they were tuning my car. im running a 2.6 with a 5% overdrive Balencer ( so that makes it like a 2.43 if my mental math is right)
i dont have the dyno sheet, i musta thrown it out on accident.
all i know is my car with basic track prep and prolly 200 lbs out of it, with a gen III goes 11.80's and i weigh 195 i must have done something right! BTW my A/C still blows ice cold !
remember
"Horsepower wins at the bars!
torque wins at the track!"

Well it really depends on where the torque is available. What good is a 1,000 foot pounds of torque if it the torque falls off after 3,000 rpms? None!!!!!! HP with RPMs gets you the top end speed needed to win!!!!

hey 2fast4u what cold air intake do you have and where did you get it from

looks like the wizaired or thrasher, but im guessing wizaired. you can get them from 3800performance.com, zzp.com, pfyc.com, wbodystore.com...not sure which one has it so i listed all the ones i think might have it..lol sorry.

what happens if you go ram air later do you just remove the box?
and sorry for the dumb quiestion i checked zzp and it was the first one i think

Ram air is really pretty useless to begin with. For it to even be effecting your speed has to be approaching triple digits. I wouldn't worry about a "functional" ram air set up.

i know but i would still like it to be functional

i have a question about rear overlays and overlays in general like the tail light overlay for the third tail light. does anyone have and pictures?

you would waste your money on a functional ram air setup. if you want a "semi" functional ram air setup, buy one of the following hoods, SD ram air hood or the SLP GTX ram air hood. they both have inlets through the front nostrils that lead over to the intake side of the engine bay. the SD also, has openings on the back of the hood to let the heat escape so that you dont suck it back in through the intake.

Yes you would need a new lid for the airbox to make a ramair functional. But at the end of the day your "functional" ramair set up will not be any better then the CAI is. Hoods with heat extractors are WAYYYYYYYYY more "functional" then any ramair set up you can put on a GP.

i meant what 01 said just one that more directs air towards the cai and i watched avid on youtube and the guy said the wizair cai or the one on zzp is a pain to get in. is this true?

Not really. Especially when you take that diagonal brace out. The problem I had was that I'm short. My arms just don't like to reach halfway across the engine bay, so getting the intake tube onto the throttle body took a lot longer than it should have. The 9x4" tapered cone takes a little bit of finagling to get in, but it can be done without the removal of the diagonal brace.

do you really have to add a extension onto the wires to reach the maf?

lol the maf is on the tb.....no extensions needed for anything.

or not maf some sort of sensor tho

the intake air temp sensor often gets extended with a CAI system.

ive never seen an IAT sensor get extended due to a cai system. all of the current systems have pretty much solved all of those problems. the IAT sensor locations on the cai's are fairly close to the TB now, some are even too close, because the IAT hole on my K&N intake is almost under the rubber couple holding the tube to the tb.

I moved my IAT sensor to the wizaird box, so I extended the sensor wires a little.

i left the rubber bend that originaly holds the IAT thats attached to the TB i have pictures in my Cold Air Intake thread

The street coupler I used for my DIY was drilled for the IAT at the same distance as the stock location. Was a nice snug fit.

so they probably have implemented that in so you dont have to do that now?

and how do you wash you engine bay i know someone just asked this but couldnt find the thread

I soak it down with Castrol's Superclean. Hose it off. Hit any areas not cleaned on the first pass again. Repeat till I'm satisfied then wipe all the plastic and rubber down with tire shine.

dont i have to cover stuff?

oh and recently my left or right blinker cant remember one of them blinks like double what it is suppose to while the other is fine and it still flashes and does the signal but the clicking is very annoying any ideas?

I never cover anything when I clean my engine bay. But I don't use any high pressure either.

As for the blinker one of your bulbs is burnt out.

i cover the alternator, battery, intake, coil packs and than i have at it. i spray it with the simple green than i use a light pressure setting on the hose to clean it off.

I do the same as 01GT, but I used a pressure washer set to low-pressure.

ha alright ill get right on that thanks and how is the bulb burnt out cause it blinks ?

check you blinker fuse when they go bad thats usually what happens with the fast blinking

just wondering, will a downpipe change the sound of exaust?

I thought you were talking about the indicator on the dash blinking.

Also if one bulb is burnt out the bulb in the front or the rear will blink fast.

If both bulbs are in fact blinking fast and on both sides then it's not a fuse but the flasher.

exactly thats what I was trying to say flasher not fuse lol

my back right light is out should i just invest in led tails?

A light bulb just blew in my daughter's room: should I just invest in a new house? no offense intended, but still...

ha none taken. its fixed but i mean i was thinking about led tail lights.

so am I, truthfully. If you're having doubts, you can buy a set, send em to me, and you can admire them from the updated signature I'd put up on here!

ha so im not the only one. and are the halos on pfyc good?

if they're the ones sold by Spyder and made by SONAR, no, not really. They're sexy as...but are plagued by problems. There was a thread about 3 weeks ago or so about an up-and-coming company that's making a set. Problem? He never did post up feedback about them. And I forgot to Favorite the link.

Here's a recent thread on halos, maybe it will help you decide what to buy: Halo Light question

that's the one. Thanks for the dig, BlackArrow.

i cant find the headlights on ebay or anywhere and to tell you the truth i would take anything over my current lights my dims are so low powered i can maybe see 20 feet infront of me and high beams are like 40

amazon has a set for like $60

Here ya go: Grand Prix Halo and Grand Prix ccfl

With HIDs: 12000K HID 97-03 Grand Prix Halo Projector Headlights

6000K HID 97-03 Grand Prix Halo Projector Headlight Blk

6000K HID 97-03 Grand Prix Halo LED Projector Headlight

what color is 6k i would rather have white instead of that annoying blue that hurts everyones eyes

6000K has a little bit of blue to it but is mostly white. 5000K is whiter yet very little blue, 4300K is about as close as you can come to pure white.

okay i looked it up sorry i should have searched first anyways does anyone have led tail lights?i dont believe there has even been a forum on that

I've got LED tails.

are they the spyders smoked? these?http://www.carid.com/2003-pontiac-grand-prix-taillights/spyder-led-tail-lights-265448.html?CAWELAID=929134991&cagpspn=pla&gclid=CPLB3ejcjKoCFUvCKgodXn1Cyw

Those are my tails, but mine are black and not smoked.

Yum!
Nice looking tail. Hahahhahha
No really... I really like the LED tails, I will buying a set here soon also... black buckets like yours.

Dont really see the sense of having any light smoked... kind of like a oxymoron

somewhat but i want a more stock look although not blacked out tails or else ill be getting my new lights rear ended and destroyed

Should stick with factory tails then.... i on the other hand, want them to be noticed.
you could buy led bulbs for factory tails... brighter than bulbs and keep the stock look

Only problem I have with the stock tails is the black trim tends to delaminate from the lense and they look horrible.

You could go with the red/clear tails: SONAR 97-03 PONTIAC GRAND PRIX LED TAIL LIGHTS LAMP SET

Wow has this thread derailed.

yeah, time for some cleanup.

ha relax about the derailing atleast we are still on the topic of cars

Only problem is when you switch topics from the thread title it gets harder to use the search function. Valuable info could be lost forever!!!!!

ha true cause we did get some tail light pics

true. and the OP is the one derailing. if the OP doesn't wanna make a bunch of new threads, I can't see the big deal.

The problem is people think the thread is about intercooling and have no input. So they stay out. The thread has turned to a different topic and those on the know won't know those questions are asked etc.

true...

hey rich does that wizair cai make a huge difference? along with the dp

Rick, please.

I sure think so, but unfortunately I don't have much by way of hard numbers. I can't even remember what the MPG increase was, but I do know that it was quite noticeable.

does it change exhaust alot? the tone and loudness

I didn't think it changed the exhaust note much, but it sure made the intake sound like a BEAST! It even gave a bit of the gargling sound that is famous in American V8s.

great cause i also do need mpg im sitting at 16.9 right now for somewhat of a mix and if my exhaust smells horid and not like exhaust and if i rev it i can see the exhaust on a warm day am i burning stuff thats not suppose to be burning?

and the smoke also seems a bit black or more greyish to black does that mean im burning oil? also where should i look or check or fix