My boss and I talked about my car engine last night. My boss is huge Ford guy. He hate GM. lol He own 3 Ford Mustang but he sold it all for extra money. Now, he has Ford Fairlane (NASCAR from 1960) to build project. Anyway, he used race drag before.

I ask his opinion about my car that have 3100 engine. I ask him is that worth it ($4000) for new 3800 with supercharger engine on my car? He says well you have front wheel drive. It cannot be good for front drive wheel. I told him really? No wonder why that I have seen lot of threads that they are complain about tranmission blown. He says, yeah that's why it is not good for front wheel drive. If your car RWD then you could use 3800 engine then.

Reason:
front wheel drive
engine fire (yes, I'm worry about that lol)
tranmission break

....


give me an hour and I bet I could break the tranny in your 3.1. it's a weaker version of the tranny that is in our 3.8.

his ford fairline tranny would break too if it had more power than it could handle and you drove it like a madman.

the reason they break is because of the power and how you drive, not because it's fwd. obviously they are limited to what they can do with fwd because of the room they have in the bay and suspension parts and everything else.

New motor engine fire is a non issue. Transmission failures tend to be not from power but poor quality to start.

I see your starting to question your 3100. Your car now has all the looks but nothing to back it up and it's wearing on you.

You talked to the wrong guy about GPs. He's a Ford fan and RWD at that and is not schooled on what can be done with FWD.

Well, he is almost 50 years old. He is big car guy. I'm not saying he is lying or whatever. He just don't want me get screwed if I have any problem with new 3800 engine for front wheel drive.

lol go ahead break your parent's car. I would waiting to see that. Oh don't forget picture of proof too

So if I'm doing daily driver (not race) so tranmission will be fine? They always break if (drag race and try to blew mustang to dust) that what are you trying to say?

Since, I'm not race person. I want keep my car as "car show". I'm not here for speeding or driving reckless stuff.

if you want a 3.8, your best off to take the mods off your car you have now and put it back to stock trim. Then sell the car and buy a GT or GTP and put your exterior mods on that. That would be cheapest. Especially since you are spending lots of money to basically turn it into a GT/P with the rocker panels and HUD.

I never said my parents SE, I said YOUR SE lol.

and you don't need to worry about your transmission, if it were that big of a problem then GP's wouldn't be a dime a dozen like they are now. Not to mention their are lots of ppl with fairly modded engines still running stock transmissions.

Well, I'm not sure if I want to do 3800 project or keep 3100 engine either. It is depend gas price. Who know if it will increase in couple years. I will wait it out and see how gas price doing and wait and see new President in 2009.

I'm not going sell my car. This car is zero payment. I don't want get other car payment for get gt or gtp. I'm not doing HUD. I changed my mind. Like I say... I will never sell my car and keep it forever no matter what.

Hour? You are from Canada. No way in chance you can get over there to try break my tranmission. It might take you like 6 hours.

actually it's like 14 hours just to get there but i'll make a road trip out of it.

you can drive my car and I can drive yours, that would be fun, no?

the savings in gas is negligble. the 3.8 is just about as efficient as your 3.1. PLUS you get an upgraded trans. And you can't put a price on happiness which is a bigger, faster, stronger motor :p

you could still get a low mileage GT or GTP for maybe 1000$ more than what you would get for your SE. Thats still 3000$ cheaper than doing just the motor swap AND the car would come with a HUD and the rocker panels you like...

just something to think about.

well randall when you come see me we can road trip to palsut lol

Palsut I have over 100k miles on my GTP and have had (knock on wood)0 tranny issues/engine fire issues. How does your 3100 mpg compare to my 34 hwy/21 city?

Your exhaust is all set up and just waiting for a bigger motor

I wasn't saying your friend lied or is clueless just biased.

Asking a Ford guy for advice FYI a well serviced an not abused trans. should be able to handle 300whp without breaking ,and a decent built trans. should handle 400whp abusive driving habits will destroy any trans. I have broken axles with drag radials on and my trans. did'nt miss a beat,if you do'nt want a 3.8 o'nt get one but do'nt bother trying convince the rest of us because I do'nt see anyone wanting to swap a 3.8 for a 3.1 ,that's like going from a Harley to a Moped .Chico(pops)

I don't want to go again for used car. SE is cheaper for insurance. If I switch to GT/GTP then insurance will be high. If I install new 3800 engine on my SE model so they won't know I have fast car lol

My car is very CLEAN. It will be hard to find nice GP around my around. I don't know where you get that for $1000 for low mileage GT/GTP. My area asking for $10,000 for 2002 GTP under 70K mileage. There are not lot GT/GTP around my area. Some of them are pretty bang up. I brought like nice navy blue but what about my galaxy silver hood and sd wing? More extra money to paint back other color. It is silly.

Some people say if you are not racing then keep 3100 engine. No reason if you buy 3800 engine if I'm not doing any racing. I'm just doing my car for "look" and take easy driving as I baby this car. That's kind mixed answer for get or not get 3800 engine.

My SE have been over 100K mileage too. No tranny or fire problem yet

I'm not sure how many mpg I have. I don't have DIC mpg like everyone have. I fill her up. I have driving this car for work/home every 50 miles each day. It is now over 200 miles today since I fill her up. It is still not reach to 3/4 yet. It is sitting middle of 3/4 and full. I bet it is bigger than 34 mpg.

You don't need a DIC to know your mpg.

Compare how many gallons it takes to fill from empty and divide by the number of miles travelled.

Give me a break.

Im not even going to get into this arguement. I hope you enjoy being slow.

SE/GT/GTP are the same price for insurance in my experience, having both an SE and a GTP.

Well, did I ask you talk about that? Not... :rolleyes:

I don't care if my car is that slow. In my Ohio law that we have speed limit for 55 or 65 on highway. Florida where you live I have seen 70 mph so far. You used be speeding freak. I know some of you are speeding freak. :p

Oh one more thing. If I decide swap them. I still use regular unleaded?

L36 yes L67 no.

lol, I guess someone could take that two ways lol.

You need to calm down (again) you're the one who opened this can of worms you do'nt see the rest of us posting" Good reason to sh-t can that gutless POS 3.1" the point I'm trying to make is if you ask for feeback your going to get it,but from what I see the 3.1 is a decent DD motor if you're not into performance the only thing for showing there's not much bling available ,since your motor is running good wait till you have problems with it to decide on a swap and a new motor is fairly expensive you could buy a good low mileage drop in for much cheaper but I woul bother with it right now since your engine seems to be fine .Chico(pops)

Palsut show your friend this picture and tell him to shut up.

This is lame discussion.
I don't think I need to point out the reliability of our 3.8 engines. That is not disputed. And we know what causes engine fires, so if you've heard about the injector o-ring issue and have an older car, laziness is what will cause your fire.

Onto the transmission:
1) on the forums we hear about transmission problems a lot.... more than engine problems. this is because most people are modding and driving around like a$$ holes, hence broken transmission.
2) if our engines had some kind of issue like other american engines, we wouldn't be paying as much attention to the transmission. it happens to be the weak spot, so why are people saying its so terrible?
3) tons of people have had their original transmission last a long time. I don't need to point out examples, but to add to it, I have 121,000 miles on my non-HD original transmission, and have been supercharged for 2.5 or 3.5 years no issues.

Thank for all the helpful tip and advice. I need lot of thinking about that all day. I will let you know official answer tomorrow.

BoostenGTP02: I emailed him a picture. He says "lol, better call a fire truck I think his engine is on fire"

Alright, I'm going say that instead tomorrow.

I have spend some time to research for 3800 engine. They are very nice and fast of course. It is nice to know that new engine won't cause any fire like old cars. Also, tranmission problem cause by 50/50 chance. Some abuse or some care. Since, I will care then I'm sure it will be fine. The FWD thing... lol I guess that's life.

I own 3 3100 engines from 1997 Oldmobile Cutless Supreme (sold it 2 months ago ), 2003 Pontiac Grand Prix (summer) and 2001 Pontiac Grand Prix (winter).

History about 3100... I meet that engine first time in April 2001. I like it very much. It was much better than my 1st car Chevy Corisca that I wrecked it. I don't remember what kind engine that car have lol... 3100 engine is pretty good. My old car Oldmobile Cutless Supreme have over 250K mileage when I sold her away to someone. My summer car now have over 100K. My winter beater is almost reach to 60K mileage. When I took my car to service for 100K mileage. This guy told me this engine is very good shape. I told him I changed it every 3,000 miles. This guy told me that's really good. It should last you forever if you keep doing that. It is feel good to know that. It is only one problem with my engine that gasket blown but it cause by coolant. I already send gm coolant lawsuit that everyone complain about that 3 weeks ago. I might get all of my money back but I have to wait and see.

Since my 3100 engine is very good shape. I hate it waste if I throw it away for nothing during swap for new 3800 engine.

I'm going to keep my 3100 engine. Yeah, I can't hear but I will probably get loud booo from grand prix crowd :p

BUT..............

Like AustinGTP.... He blown engine like May or whenever and he use it other chance. I believe his car is 1997. He is pretty good job to keep body clean over 11 years. If something happen to my engine then it will be good chance that I will swap new 3800 engine. My car is 5 years old and over 100K mileage. It will take some time to see what happen in future. Since GM stop making 3800 engine. I think it is safe to say I might not get any new 3800 like 5 years later. Who know how good my 3100 engine. It is still good right now. Sorry long type but want to tell how I feel about 3100 and 3800.

AustinGTP's is a 99. And some of these engines can go for ever and some just bite the dust early, just like any other car.
Guy on clubgp just blew his motor, extensive mods, but found some hair ball like stuff in his oil screen. You're right, you most likely won't find a new 3800, unless you search hard.
You got your car for a DD, that's what it is.
If you now decided you want to Mod like most on here, then you either get a GP with a 3800, or you swap one in!
Yes, they are all FWD, unless you change that, but FWD has managed to pull 8 secs in the 1/4!

New 3800 crate motor.
http://www.tran-steer.com/GM%20Performance%20Parts%20-%20Crate%20Engines.htm

Palsut, don't do the 3.8 engine until you have problems with your 3.1 engine. It doesn't seem like your fully into the swap so I say stick to the 3.1.

I want to do what rook has done but I'm not going to do that until like a year and a half from now because I'm almost at 200,000 miles and the tranny is slipping a little bit.

I would keep my 3.8 V6 POS as its being called over ANY Ford product on any given day. At least I dont have to worry bout my blocik splitting in 2 like his 5.slo Fagstangs.

I won't swap until it has problem. Maybe I should never change oil so it can blow up? nah

I'm pretty impressed with my new exhaust. I have already drive nearly 200 miles since I fill her up last Saturday night. My gas tank still haven't reach to 3/4 yet which it cannot be right (usually under 3/4 on Wednesday). Now, it is Friday and it is still above 3/4. Huge differance than my driving habit. I like it very much right now. I have read some of you get 21-25 mpg. That's pretty low number. Mine should be 30+ mpg.

I will order my new 3100 cold intake that will help little mpg this winter season.

I didn't swap until I had issues with my 3100... the exact same issues I had before: intake gaskets. They're a plague to the 3100/3400 series engines. Apparently GMs poor decision to use a plastic gasket for the intake, coupled with dexcool, just eats them away. I've lost count of the numerous 60* engines I've seen come into work that are getting intake gaskets done or need it done (yum, cream under the oil cap).

Your engine won't blow due to anything with oil change, it will blow when you get some coolant down in the crankcase and it eats the bearings. It's not exactly a fun job to finish either and will run you around $800 if you have someone else do it. 3800s do get intake leaks, but they usually pool on top of the motor, not in it, and they're much less common.

I got 30mpg with my 3100 on the interstate and 26 or so average driving around my area. My 3800 gets around 27mpg interstate, and 22-23 average, but you have to remember, it's pretty well modded (and that's with me hitting the happy pedal a couple times). I never got a chance to drive it prior to my modifications either.

Thank for tip Rook. I will see if I have any problem in future. So far, I know I still have healthy engine right now. They already fixed gasket intake at 70K mile BUT the engine coolant didn't went into oil yet. My Oldmobile Cutlass Supreme did that. I got worse one. This car, I got lucky this time to noticed some leaking from value cover. It is now over 30K since repair. So far it is getting good (finger cross)

Hercman... can you give me example about how to solve the mpg? I'm suck with math lol

I usually fill her up when it is reach to 1/4. It is hard to tell how much empty tank I have?

MPG literally means MILES per GALLON.

you take how many MILES you drive, and divide it by how many GALLONS you used...

400 miles / 14 gallons = 28.6 MPG

I guess I will have to try that when I fill her up. It might take forever because I'm still on 3/4 since I fill her up last Saturday. That will be one week tomorrow

For example like

482 miles / how much gallon I fill her up usually around 15.80 something = mpg right?

You don't have to use a whole tank to get the mpg, but it provides a better average.

Just fill the car up, reset the odometer trip and drive. When you've used about half a tank, go fill it up again, note the gallons the pump puts into your tank and divide that by what the trip says. It's that easy.

i'd laugh if your sending unit is pooched and you run out of gas haha.

Something isn't right. Your tank is what, say, 15 gallons? 1/4 of that would be 3.75 gallons.

if you have driven 200 miles already and have only used 1/4 then that would be 200/3.75 = 53+ mpg...

even if that was all highway driving their is no way you would get 53+ mpg, even if you are going 55.

Sending units are odd how they work. The one in my GP hits 1/4 tank after 10 gals have been used and then drops fairly quickly. My Stratus stays above 3/4 until you hit around 130miles and drops fast for the remaining fuel.

Also, our tanks are 17gal.

Sound like easy to do that. I will do that next time when I fill her up to know what my mpg is.

I don't know if it is broken or I save lot of gas for new exhaust install? It is just reach to 3/4 this afternoon. It will be 250 miles when I get home from work tonight. I will drive it until fuel light come on to make sure that thing is working or broken. I will start fill gas tank can on trunk if I ran out this weekend.

That would be sweet if my car get 53+ mpg

1/4 of 17 is 4.25 and 200/4.25 is still 47 mpg.

i think it drops off fairly quickly at the end because of the shape of the tank. so lets go with 3/8 of the tank used rather than 1/4 because of the variance. 3/8 of 17 is 6.375. 200/6.375 = 31 mpg.

thats saying that he drove 200 miles (which he hadn't quite reached yet so that would lower the MPG) and saying that he used 3/8 of the tank (which we'll never know really know because of the variables). saying he used a little less gas like 5/16 turns out to be 37+ mpg i think.

31 mpg +/- 4 mpg (which i'm going to say is how much it could be off given the information we have) is right on par with what alot of modded 3.8's are getting on the hwy.

even with giving it a large benefit of the doubt, the gas savings is not really anything over a modded 3.8.

You might never know if my car is improving.

I will try again after I fill her up when it is hit low fuel light. I will start doing mpg math thing when I reset the trip mileage.

This car don't carry any items. My trunk is empty. Nothing on backseat. I use a/c sometimes during afternoon. I don't slam gas hard for "rabbit jump". Of course, I'm doing 55 mph.

If you think it is silly to keep 3100 instead swap 3800 engine because of gas saver. Well who know... In past 7 years after 9/11 attack. The gas price is keep rising and still going. Right now, it is getting improving go down but I heard it will rise back because of Texas oil problem during weather. I'm not future guy but who know if we might get like $4, $5, $6, $7, $8, $9 or more gallon

There are lot of change during gas price. Some of members sell gp for small car. Hybrid cars look like it is getting grow big. SUV & Truck are getting down. There are lot of small cars around. GM stop making V8 engine (I remember I read somewhere but I can't find link). That's probably reason GM stop make 3800 engine. It seems everyone going to make small engine instead powerful engine. I know it is suck have slow ass engine but everything have been change lot. Sh!t happen I guess. At least I'm not whine about my car mpg. I'm happy as long it is still good enough for 2 weeks instead week when I used be speeding freak.

I'm pretty sure GM still makes a V8.

It was month ago. I swear they will stop make by 2010?

GM invested money in the modular 60* engines with adjustable valve timing and went to larger engines (3.5 and 3.9ltr V6). They're still making tons of V8s, especially in trucks (4.8, 5.3, 6.0).

Anyway, a 3800 swap because of gas mileage is stupid. If his engine works and he's happy with the power, end of story. If he wanted more power... then we'd have a reason to lure him to the dark side. BTW, mildly modded 3800s get 30mpg... anything with a cam is another story unless you do some serious tuning.

No one ever said a word to Rook or any of the other guys about having their 3.1L motor. You bring this on yourself bu saying "good reason to not get 3800 engine". If you are going to dis our engine with the crap that you are typing, then we are going to disprove your faulty logic. If you just stop talking about it, we will let it go.

I don't know if anyone else pointed this out, but don't you have that backwards?

I'm not trying say bad thing to your 3800 engine. I just saying it might be bad because of fire and tranmisson blown but now I know everything. It is over with that. Like I say I would swap to 3800 engine if I have any problem with my 3100 engine. I get some of members trying tell me dump 3100 engine and get 3800 engine.

I got home tonight. My gas guage is now under 3/8. I hope it is really exhaust make my gas mileage improving or guage went bad. I have to wait until it is empty. It might be take forever empty that gas

Er, yeah. Divide trip by the gallons.

The fact is modern gasoline engines are just getting more efficient ,my son in law just bought a new Mercedes 3.2E bluetech an it gets 39mpg. and for V8 power my GTO gets 26mpg which is pretty decent for a factory performance car ,my thoughts are the future engines will just be more efficient performance which means power adders such as turbos an SC's will be common on many vehicles ,even Palsut could retain his 3.1 and with the addition of a Turbo setup he could retain good gas mileage an have performance also,we come a long way since the muslecars of the 60's were a 350 hp car was lucky to get 14mpg.Chico(pops)

turbo on 3100 engine? Only if it is true

Timeline for gas of my car.

Saturday night: fill her up to full.
Sunday: I don't remember I drive this car or winter beater either. (still full)
Monday: about 50 miles for work/home (still full)
Tuesday: about 50 miles for work/home (still full)
Wednesday: about 50 miles for work/home (start moving down but not reach to 3/4)
Thursday: about 50 miles for work/home (still haven't touch 3/4 but very close)
Friday: about 50 miles for work/home (finally pass 3/4)

You went 150+ miles on one quarter of a tank? I get 100 if I don't hot rod it...

Yes, is that wrong? If your is 100 but mine is 150. It could be extra 50 miles save gas?

gas mileage with 3800vs3100, 31 will win in the gas mileage race lol

Yes, but see, that's why if I agreed to a race like that, I would bring a shotgun with me. Tip the scales in my favor a little... ;-)

hahaha

For one thing you can't compare mileage by what the gas guage reads. They' aren't accurate enough.

In 2000 GM gave the 3.1 a rating of 20/30 and the L67 a rating of 18/28.

Which when you look at the difference in power 175 compared to 240 the differences are negligable.

Awesome pic Herc!

Need advice. My 2001 GTP has all the power I'd ever want in a midsize car. Problem is, it sounds like a lawn mower. Exhaust is totaly stock. Want it to sound like it moves. Any suggestions??

get a 3" dp. this will delete your ubend and free up some power while also giving your exhaust more 'volume'. remove the resonator just after this and replace it with straight pipe. then get some aftermarket mufflers of your choice or leave the stockers on and see how you like it. this will make it louder and give a nice rumble.

Swap in a V8!

lol that's good idea. I would like to race for fuel mileage but everyone are pussy to know 3800 ate lot of gas than mine. Who will be brave to vs. me?

I don't believe gm rating crap. I rather check my mileage and gallon to see actaully mpg for my driving habit.

lol way to kill thread. 3800 sound like lawn mower? ow... good to know

This morning, I took my car to visit my dad to hear the exhaust sound. He told me it is very good. He was driving my car lot. My dad is 70 years old. He feel like he is very young again. He rev it lot but I hate that but what can I do with that. He is my dad so I let him have fun. When 2 old couple walking outside neighbor. They saw my dad and he hit gas hard for "show off". I laughed. I bet this old couple thinking wow... old guy have nice gp and we have crappy lincoln town car. Now, my gas is almost reach to 1/2 but I have full gas can on my trunk if gauge fail.

Drive on down I'll do a run with you to do a MPG race. I'll be nice enough to even let you sleep on the couch.

I know I can knock down 34mpg on the highway and that's at 67mph.


What hasn't been mentioned is the fact that the GTP is geared for mpg where as the SE/GTs are geared to get them moving. If you put the 2.94 gear in the SE that weighs north of 3500 pounds you won't be able to get it out of it's own way when you leave from a light.

i was hitting 35.5 mpg at 75 mph on the highway today and i'm mildly modded.

show this vid to your bos
http://vids.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=vids.individual&videoid=3537887

I'm closer to stock than modded I guess, but when I was road-tripping to Maryland I was laying down 35-36mpg. at or around 75mph.

One my way back I saw a GTP, looked just like yours r.s.

I'll just add this last bit the current 3800 engine derives from the Buick roots of the 3.8 made famous in the mid 80's with the Buick Grand National and in this period these were one of the quickest American cars available humbling so called v8 muscle cars of the day,in fact this buick engine has proven time and time again it's ability to take boost give extreme performance an hold together it ranks right up there with the smal block chevy for longevity,the only reason I see that GM is discontinueing the 3800 is that it's too good ,I ca'nt say so much for the 3.1 I'm afraid .Chico(pops)

Thats funny because I've heard that before at the dealership thats by me. I bought my car in for service one time(I was still under warranty then) and they say that they wish people would give up this grand prix's and grand ams because that put so many miles on these cars and its crazy people would drive 200,000 and 300,000 miles on these cars. I was lmfao when I heard that.

Check this thread out Palsut, turbo, or swapping over the 3100:

http://www.clubgp.com/newforum/tm.asp?m=4563306&p=1&tmode=1&smode=1

lol thank hercman... I will see you someday to race you for mpg thing. I will keep you post.

I don't see nothing wrong with 200,000 or 300,000 miles on this car. Your dealership might be retard. It is pretty good car last longer. I would keep both GP forever to save me some money until whatever my future will be. I have 250,000 miles 1997 Oldmobile Cutlass Supreme. I sold it because I like GP look better than this. Oh my dad have 1985 Chevy Caprice (brand-new). It is very huge car. I love gas this car from rear bumper where plate is. He has it until 1997. 12 years and lot of mileage on this car. The engine was blew up.

Turbo on 3100 engine? That's new but I think turbo eat lot of gas? I would wait and see how my mpg doing first before I decide to swap them or not. My gas gauge hit orange mark tonight. It is turn "low fuel" light on. My gauge is fine but I bet I saved lot of gas after new exhaust installed. Tomorrow morning, I need fill her up and start reset trip to zero then start math thing when it is empty for other 2 weeks later. I'm looking forward that for what is real mpg.

jesus christ i only get 250 a tank if im lucky damn pos gp of mine

...That is all...

I'm sorry if you are upset about my gas mileage is better than your car. It is always good time to swap 3100. Ed still have it

Anyway, I believe I should fill her up on Friday or Saturday either.

During strong wind. The traffic light was broken for 3 days. (Monday, Tuesday and Wednesday) It took me 20-30 minutes to get out during sitting for "4 ways stop sign". This lanes is 4. That's biggest traffic. That's kill my mpg. Last night, I was on way to home but huge wreck make one lane open instead 3 lanes. The purple Scion TC got heavy damage all over. I bet it is young punk driving idiot that cause other 3 van/trunk/car into mess. I sit like 10 minutes. Again it is kill other mpg. I haven't fill her up yet but I will fill her up tonight because my local gas station still closed since Sunday during power failure.

no. we are upset because this is a stupid topic that wont go away

hahaha.... I still update for gas mileage. I want to see how much mpg I will get. This guy got 250 miles on full tank? Mine is double than that. I think I should get like 500 miles left.

Please somebody close this thread because its getting a little out of control.

What are you talking about? I'm talking about my gas mpg. How it is out of control? :rolleyes:

Ignore it, it will go away.

I wasn't talking about your mpg. I'm talking about the 3.1 vs a 3.8 and some people comments are getting a little bit out of control and I just feel that both engines are good far as reliability and mpg. My friends gtp gets 28 mpg and he is modded.(lightly)

oh... it is way over for that about 3.1 vs. 3.8 anyway. I will make new thread about my new mpg in 2 weeks later instead this thread.

Not that i want to be off topic, but how does every one of Palsut's threads reach high pages?

oh and 3800FTW!

Because they wonder off topic and are repetive ,and for me I could care less about gas mileage but in a head to head contest of gas mileage I would bet on Herc because a GTP has a better gear ratio(for mileage) and I think the 3100 is underpowered for a GP and belongs in a Grand Am.Chico(pops)

I guess they love me

Look turbo on 3400 engine video. It is almost same as my 3100 engine. It could be done. Also, they have swap for 3400 engine on SE model too. Pretty interesting. They are more cheaper than 3800 engine.

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/turbo-cammed-grand-am_183937.htm

3400 engine is 300 bigger than your 3100 and Chico i agree tottaly haha.